>> All right. We are so excited to have all of you here, as Mercy was saying as we got going. This is a REALM presentation and my name is Kendra Morgan and I'm a Senior Program Manager here at WebJunction. I'm joined today by three co-presenters, Bexx Caswell-Olson from the Northeast Document Conservation Center -- one second, folks. We are just going to end the presentation view. Northeast Document Conservation Center as well as Chris Carron from The Children's Museum of Indianapolis, which many of you have already seen some of the slides for today and are excited about his facility. We are also joined by scott Carey, who is the Chief Information Officer for the museum of library services. This is made possible by the Institute of Museum and Library Services, the library of Congress, Andrew melon foundation and Carnegie Corporation of New York. I'm going to turn it over to scott to open. Thanks for joining us, scott. >> Thank you, Kendra. The REALM project was started as an outcome of a webinar that the Institute of Museum and Library Services hosted with the center for Disease Control and Prevention on the 30th of March. The cdc providing guidance for environment disinfection and how we can mitigate COVID-19 working with primarily at the time paper based circulating and other times of collections. While that discussion was very well received, the guidance regarding the attenuation, or if you will, the life cycle of the virus on materials common to this community was very limited and it left many questions unanswered. Beyond that, given the very specific operational practices that exist within this community, the REALMproject was developmented to fill the information void. REALM, Reopening archives, Libraries, and Museums, is simply stated a research partnership between OCLC, BETTEL and the Institute of Museum and Library Services. Our fundamental aim is to conduct research on how long the COVID-19 virus lives on materials in museums and archivearchives and how to mitigate exposure to staff and visitors. So there is a website listed on this page. I encourage you to visit the website for more information on the project. Look at our research timeline and peruse the committee members we have assigned to operational and scientific working groups as well as our steering committee. We are passionate about transparency in project updates and resources will be added to this information hub as soon as they become available. That said, we encourage you to sign up to receive project updates, whether by e-mail, well, by e-mail and even bookmark the page if you like as it will be your primary source for information about program results and resources. And by the way, you can also follow OCLC on Facebook, Twitter and linkedin. If you want to follow on twitter use the #REALMproject. One key to understanding REALM is the project is providing information to better understand the virus with the simple goal of informing your risk-based decision making as you develop your operational practices and policies. It is a universal human trait to want to know what is best to keep everyone safe. Now, that said, I will say that REALM is not making recommendations. And with approximately 140,000 libraries and museums across this nation, the variability amongst institutions is quite substantial and each will need to develop policies that work for both themselves as well as their local communities. Okay, Kendra? >> Great. Thanks so much, scott. >> We wanted to spend time before we dive into the content around collections and policies talking at a high level about some of the challenges we are all faced when we are managing uncertainty right now during the pandemic. One of the places we have found some helpful and reinforcing information is an article recently published in the British Medical Journal Managing Uncertainty in the COVID-19 Era. When we think about managing resources, one of our strongest and most powerful resources is the staff that work in our institutions. We want to acknowledge this is a really challenging time. The uncertainty leads to a lot of stress and confusion. And we can acknowledge that, right? We are all going through that in both our professional lives and personal lives. These five simple rules that the authors outlined are helpful to frame the discussions you may be having with stakeholders internally and externally. So the first is that most data will be flawed or incomplete. There is going to be more you want to know, and as Scott said, we are trying to be as transparent as possible with the data we have and putting it out there quickly with this project. It is probably not going to meet all of the needs of every person. That is one of the five rules for understanding. The second is we may never have final answers. Waiting on certainty versus the evidence you might have to act is a really important part of the process. We can certainly acknowledge that this is a complex situation and there is a lot that we don't know and there are going to be paradoxes. We encounter those a lot in this project as we are talking through ideas about which items to test under which conditions and there's a lot of complexity in that situation and certainly in all of your organizations. The next point is that different people seek out data differently. I think if we just consider the news sources that we use, but looking and seeking out perspectives for other solutions is a powerful and important part of the process. And then finally, observing real-world interventions can complement the findings of the trials and evidence that we have, right? We are constantly going to be evolving and I think that is a really important part of this. We do get new information. Things will constantly be changing and that is an important aspect to communicate about your resources when you are talking to the public, when you are talking to the staff. You're really doing the best that you can with the information that's available. So it's a great article. We encourage you to check it out, share it with others, and use this as a basis for helping to inform and talk about the decisions that you might be making locally. The next thing that we want to touch on is a little bit about the known unknowns when it comes to coronavirus or COVID-19. And this information that is really shaping some of the release of information coming from the project. The first is that we don't know how many virus cells it takes to -- an infected person will leave behind on an object, through sneezing, through coughing. There has been lots of research, but there is no definitive answer. People are continuing to look. The hope, of course, is they do change into known items, but for now, it is a known unknown. The next unknown is how many virus cells you can pick up from an object. So when you are touching something, what is likely to be transferred? We don't know. And then finally, how many cells are needed to cause infection? With all the different viruss out in the world, each one has a different level of infectious rate and so that is something that we don't yet know for COVID-19. They are looking into it, of course, in the research field. This is realtively new pandemic. It is going take a lot of time and effort in order to be able to answer these questions. So sitting with these unknowns can be really challenging because we want the answers. As we learn more and, of course, in the media we hear as thing evolve. We are keeping on top of this and understand how it might inform libraries, museums, and archives in their operations. Wanted to touch quickly on the results that are coming out of the REALM project. One of them we've been so far released a total of four sets of test results. These are all available on the REALM site. And this is just a quick overview of items we have tested so far. We are continuing to test items. Another test report comes out next week looking at materials like fabrics and upholstery. And then we are continuing to plan future tests. But you can find information about all of these materials and what we've tested so far on the REALM website. I encourage you to do that. The URL will be posted in the chat. It is one source of information, right? We know you are looking to connect internally with folks as you make decisions. And this is exclusively studying how long the SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, how long that virus can survive on surfaces. So let's talk real quickly about how you might be able to use these results. So the first is really thinking about the decisions you are making within your organization and keeping informed about federal, state, and local guidelines. And how those might inform and change your ideas about the policies and procedures your organization has. The next is looking at CDC guidelines on PPE and hygiene practices. How can you help to implement those within your facility? How do they align with your KRNT practices? What is realistic for your organization? The third is to consider if there are items within your collection or resources that can be sanitized without damage and I'm really happy to have Bexx here to talk about the work NEDCC does in part of their everyday engagement in the field around disenfecting and cleaning and caring for items. If you are looking at quarantining items, look at the REALM results and the life span of the virus on relevant materials. This is a good one as well. Quite a few organizations take the REALM results to their local health department, state health department. This is what we know about some of the materials common in our facilities. Can you work with us to come up with policies based on these results. That is a really powerful partnership, taking all of the information and resources available to you and making those open to the development of your resources and policies. Asking your peer institutions for their policies. What are other organizations in your area doing? A really big part of this is that things are constantly changing. So as we gain more information, as maybe the situation in your community improves and the rate of infection drops, fewer people are sick, that may cause a change to your policies and how might you work together to -- on your messaging and on your communications to both internal and external stakeholders, which is the next step. So that's another place where you really want to work on keeping people informed and being part of that conversation, I think, admitting around the ambiguity and the fact this is an evolving situation is a really important aspect of that work. So, we're going switch over now to hear from Bexx Caswell-Olson, from the Northeast Document Conservation Center. I want to, just before we get started, both Bexx and Chris are here today as part of their roles within their organization and they've developed their own policies and procedures in the work that they do. These are not REALM recommendations. These are how their individual organizations are approaching these issues and questions. And a huge part of this opportunity is really to hear from people in the field and how they are approaching these issues and questions. So we really appreciate their time today. With that, I'll turn it over to Bexx. Thanks for joining us. >> Hi. Thank you. So I am Bexx Caswell-Olson, the director of book conservation and the Northeast Document Conservation Center. I want to talk about disenfecting books and collections and materials and pros and cons of different methods and how things can be damaging to our collections materials. So as you can imagine, disenfecting collections and materials is a question that we've been getting a lot here at NEDCC. And in response to that, we decided to release a formal publication on this topic as part of our series on preservation leaflets. Preservation leaflets are a free series of publications on our website. Head to NEDCC.org, this is what the landing page looks like. I have a nice big red arrow pointing to the button for preservation leaflets. So leaflet 3.5 is called disenfecting books and other collections. There are a lot of other great leaflets on this page. They are free in html and printable PDFs. I will reference a couple of these today. So before I jump in and start talking about some different disenfectant methods, I want to talk about things that cause damage. This is from the CCI's agents of deterioration. So the 10 agents of deterioration, physical damage, improper handling, theft and vandalism, fire, water, pests, pollute Tants, poor air equally, light, temperatures, extreme highs and lows, humidity, again, extreme highs and lows. Improper storage. I have I lighted item 6-9 which will come into play as we talk about different disenfection methods. So I think by now we have all heard the advice we should be regularly sanitizing high-touch surfaces, doorknobs, shared equipment, self-checkout stations, tables, Et cetera. Definitely please keep doing that. Maybe let's think twice about using cleaning products on our collections materials. While I can't recommend a specific cleaning product because there are so many different things out there, I can recommend you consult EPA list N disinfectants for coronavirus. They have been tested to be effective against coronavirus. Any of these are safe to use for that purpose. Right now it is really hard to find certain things and availability can vary, but if you have the availability to be discerning when choosing a product, I would say pay attention to the contact time listed in the far right hand column. Times can range from 30 seconds to 10 minutes. Again, if you have the ability to be a little bit choosey, go with something with a shorter contact time. And if you can be more discerning, I might try to select a product that is free from artificial fragrances or Dyes. These products on this list have been approved on hard, non-porous surfaces, tables and doorknobs, but not cloth or paper. If you are using these things in a setting with archival materials or rare books, for instance to disinfect tables any of these products are safe to use. Make sure your surface is 100% dry before you set down collections materials. Thinking about that list, the agents of deterioration, I would classify a liquid cleaning product is pollutant and humidity risk. Many cleaning products will contain harsh chemicals that can cause moisture damage, accelerate aging and EM brittlement of materials can break down cellulous and paper and cloth. Can cause staining, discolor ration, bleaching and remove color from leather cloth or paper. So a little bit because I wanted to prove a point, I decided to test a couple of different cleaning products and how they would respond to a cloth. I chose some book cloth we have at the center. All three of these cloth samples meet the standard for library binding, meaning they are color fast and water resistant to up to 10 minutes of exposure. The first thing I wanted to do is put that water resistance to the test. A wet paper towel, pretty wet and scrubbed hard like I was having a bad day on these samples and was not able to get any color off. The water beat it up and evaporated. I tried some bleach-free disenfecting wipes. The active ingredient is ammonium chloride. I was surprised how much color came off especially on the orange cloth in the middle. I noticed the disenfecting wipes leave a foamy, sticky residue, which I didn't really care for. Then I tried a 70% solution of alcohol and water, which is what we are using at the center to clean tables and shared equipment in between uses. If I had to recommend a cleaning product, that is what I would recommend. I was shocked about the amount of color I was able to pick up very, very quickly without scrubbing. I think it is really important to notice that the alcohol and the disenfecting wipes affected these cloths differently. Which tells me it is going to be really, really hard to find one product that is going to be safe for use on everything in your collection. So fogging of disenfectant is what I'm hearing more about. This falls into the pollutant and humidity categories. Fogging is interesting because it is a good way to disperse disenfect in a large area for short time. This has potential for classrooms b but at the moment the EPA is not recommending this effort for COVID-19 because it is not tested for safety and efficacy. I have seen cleaning companies advertise this as a service. They are saying it is EPA approved. That is misleading. They are using products on EPA lists, but not necessarily for this application. Fogging is appropriate for use on hard surfaces. So not on things like upholstery or paper or carpet and only exposed surfaces will be sanitized, so a closed book or books in a stack aren't going to adequately be sanitized. This has to be done by a vendor. I think that makes it expensive and therefore perhaps very impractical for disenfecting collections on a regular basis. So the next thing I want to talk about is ultraviolet light, UV. UVa, UV B and UVC. UVC can cause burning and generate Ozone, it is damaging to human health in terms of respiratory, cardiovascular and central nervous system. You want to limit exposure. UVB, the b stands for burning. Exposure greatly increasing your risk of skin cancer and cataracts. UVA, A is for aging. It increasing your chances for skin cancer, aging, wrinkles, 1,000 times less effective for disenfection. We know UV can be used in some instances, we still need to do more research to know how effective it is against SARS-CoV-2. I think it makes sense in a laboratory or clinical setting, but we want to make sure we are keeping ourselves and our employeeing safe. I have seen a lot of -- employees safe. I have seen a lot of UV products being sold on the market. Hand held products are unlikely to be strong enough to adequately sanitize materials. There are some serious human health concerns you want to take into account. The FDA has a great website that tells you all of this and more and we can put a link to that in the chat if you are interested in doing more reading. I have seen library and archive suppliers selling these live enclosed UV sanitation machine, which is interesting, but we don't know how much UV exposure is needed for this particular virus. I couldn't find information from the manufacturers the dose of UV these machines are subjecting your materials to. That is a red flag. They cost $1,000 and $6,000 which is out of reach for a lot of institutions. Like fogging, only surfaces getting direct contact with light are disenfected. A closed book or books in a stack is not adequately sanitized. UV causes damage to collection materials. This book was open and on exhibit in an area where it got artificial light and direct sunlight. The page on exhibit is much darker and discolored than the paging below. It feels dryer and more brittle from daily UV exposure. The UV sanitation lamps emit a much higher and concentrated dose of UV, much more damaging than your daily sun exposure. So all light is damaging, but UV light is the most damaging. It is important to remember that light damage is cumulative and irreversible. Light damage can cause fading, discolor ration, advanced aging, EM brittlement of paper, plastics, fabrics, Et cetera. I showed a paper that yellowed and darkened. This is the exact opposite. A book cover that is severely faded. Best practices for collections care include eliminating or minimizeg as much UV light as possible where collections are present, blocking out sunlight, maybe putting UV filtering glaze or film on your windows, but filtering out UV from artificial light sources like fluorescent lights, filters or changing them out to l.e.d.s. Brocking from high doses of UV is contrary to the basic element of collections care so it is not something I feel comfortable recommending in this context. If you are interesting in learning more about light and how it damages collection materials, check out NEDCC information and we can put a link in the chat. Heat is the last thing I want to talk about. There is some research out there that shows that heat can be effective at killing coronavirus. So I just wanted to address that. Again, best practices for collections care really advise against exposing our materials to high temperatures and extreme fluctuations in temperature. So the chemical reactions that lead to dee -- deterioration happens twice as fast with each 10-degree temperature increase. Causing advanced aging, discolor ration, distortion and EM brittlement paper anded a HEES Vivs can soften, melt or shrink. I don't think heat is for archive or library seasons. For fun, I decided to bake some books. I found a literature review in the review of medical Virology, we can share a link. Exposure to 60 to 57 degrees Celsius is sufficient for killing virus. I put a couple of books in our oven at 65 Celsius for 3, 5, and 20 minutes. After three minutes warping, five was much worse, 20 is very much noticeable. I will say that both of the books flattened out when they cooled down, but when I checked on them the next day, the paper back binding, the adhesive failed. The heating and cooling caused it to crack. This could be very, very damaging our materials and isn't super practical for most institutions. If I'm not recommending things like cleaning products, UV, heat, what do I recommend? Well, because all of these other disenfection methods cause damage, NEDCC is recommending quarantining materials over over methods. Quarantining materials is safe for people and collections. It is something we know to be effective. The virus will die naturally on its own after a period of time. It is a low or no-cost solution, which I think is really appealing. I think a lot of places are feeling a budget crunch especially at this point in time. I would say all of that aside, the very, very best thing you can do to protect yourself, your staff, your patrons is to practice good personal hygiene, disenfect high touch surfaces, wash your hands and wear a mask. I know that is a lot of information in a short period of time. I'm happy to take questions at the end of the session or e-mail be at bcaswell@NEDCC.org. >> Thanks, Bexx. There were a few questions that came through and one of them was just how do you know if you have UV lights? To clarify, a UV light is something you purchase something separately. Most offices have fluorescent or incandescent lights. UV lights are used in special circumstances. You wouldn't normally have them in your office as part of your general operations. >> Definitely not, although there is UV in both fluorescent and incandescent light. It is not necessarily going to be as harmful, but, yes, a UV lamp is a specific lamp that you would have to buy. >> Great. And one of the things I think it is important, you know, when retalking about, we have different types of institutions part of the project's core audience. Some libraries may have -- I would say you have to consider what your collection is and if there's more of a risk tolerance for some damage to the material. If it is more of a popular fiction. That may change your approach. It is something else to consider. If you're not concerned about preservation and conservation in the long term. Does that sound realistic? >> Yeah. Absolutely. If you are thinking about circulating collections with a finite life span, you know after a few years you are planning to withdraw those, don't worry as much about causing damage that is going to show up over time. If these are parts of your permanent collection or research collection, rare, archival materials, that is something you definitely want to take into consideration. >> Great. Thank you. I did see quite a few questions come through more about what I touched on at the beginning about the amount of virus being used in the REALM testing. I will save those to the end. I also want to point out and Jennifer can pop a link in the chat to the FAQs on the REALM website, which can be really helpful in terms of understanding some of the methods and procedures being used as part of REALM and the bit of background information. Some pretty well-documented information there that can help inform you. As a listener. All right. Thanks, Bexx. I'm going to turn it over to Chris Carron, the director of collections at The Children's Museum of Indianapolis. He is going to talk about how their organization has been responding to the COVID-19 crisis. Thanks, Chris. >> Hi, everybody. In addition to my day job as director of collections at The Children's Museum of Indianapolis, I have also been serving as a member of the operating working group for the REALM project. And today I just want to give you a quick case study of what reopening in the middle of a pandemic looks like for the largest children's museum in the world. Depending on where your institution is in this process, this may either all be a real revelation to you or it Macon firm what you are already doing and look all too familiar. Our phased re-opening began in late June and continued into early July. We are now open full hours with advanced ticket sales only and capacity limitations for the entire museum and also for each individual experience, based on social distancing calculations and on our county regulations. Floor staff are working at full force to enhance our visitor experience. Professional and office staff are still working from home as much as possible. Staff must be pre-approved to be in the building and are screened on a daily basis upon entering. We're also working with a panel of scientists and countywide medical professionals who are advising our board on the latest medical and scientific information. Stated simply, we are doing the following for the safety of our staff, our volunteers and our visitors. We're limiting crowds based on Marion County guidelines. We are enabling and enforcing social distancing. We are frequently and thoroughly cleaning all surfaces. We're increasing our air filtering and maximizing outdoor air exchange. We're requiring masks and face coverings. We're encouraging regular hand washing and hand sanitizing and we are screening employees and asking visitors who are sick to please stay home. Our overall experience exhibition strategy is keeping actives on the floor that can be sanitized, but removing interactives that cannot withstand cleaning or make social distancing difficult. We are providing families a new Mission: Discovery guide, to highlights hands off, and eyes and minds on experiences. Similar to I SPI games. We are bringing experiencing to life through live story telling. And we are providing tools for visitors to manage their own health and safety. Here you can see that cleaning times are clearly posted. So visitors know when an experience will be temporarily shut down during the day for deep cleaning. And also when it will reopen again. All levels of museum staff are signing up for dozens of daily shifts to clean high-traffic surface areas, like railings and benches. Visitors are encouraged to clean hands-on activities, like touchable props and touch screens with sanitized wet wipes both before and after their use. The museum's 7 1/2 acre Riley Children's Health Sports Legends Experience is through the end of October. So families can enjoy the museum and fresh air while limiting the time they spend inside. Our haunted House experience has been moved outside this year to ensure social distancing. HVAC systems have been set to maximize the amount of outside air exchange. We are using hospital-grade filtration systems to clean the air inside our facility. Corridors and high-traffic areas are Marked with entrances and exits and one way traffic flow arrows to also help promote social distancing. Tight spaces where children play and run and crawl have been temporarily closed. Interactive spaces that cannot accommodate social distancing have also been temporarily closed or we've added barriers and signage in other interactive areas to promote and enforce social distancing. The museum has added more than 100 additional hand sanitizing stations, allowing visitors to take charge of their own health and to protect the health of others. Barriers have been added to divide interactive stations and separate family groups. In experiences where interactives had to be closed or removed, new enhancements have sometimes been added like additional object cases, so that families can have more eyes-on and minds-on fun. Behind the scenes, the collections department has developed pandemic policies and procedures to quarantine any objects as they arrive in the building while they aclimbtize. We try to quarantine objects before they go out for use in programming and exhibits. Based on new test information from REALM, we recently chose to increase our quarantine time frame from three days to five days. As we have removed or closed some hands-on activities, we have added more staff interpreter and actor interpreter led programs to deliver the same content in a different and inspiring way. Surveys that we conducted of our first returning visitors revealed that some of them wanted to know exactly what is open and what is closed. Others just felt reassured hearing all the things we were doing for their safety. Clear communication on our website, through social media, through traditional media and e-mail before they bought their tickets as well as onsite once they arrived was both needed and appreciated. Sometimes in 2020 having a sense of humor is the best way to diffuse the tension. We knew we would get some visitors, mostly adults, not kids, who wouldn't want to wear their masks, but at our museum, even the dinosaurs have to wear them. Starting when we first closed to the public and continuing now that we're open, we're working to provide the same quality of experiences online for those who can't or aren't yet ready to come back. To date, we have produced several hundred videos, digital jigsaw puzzles of the collections, science experiments, physical activities for staying fit while you are stuck at home and so much more available through our social media channels. Since most traditional school field trips have been temporarily canceled, we created content for teachers to use with students, whether they are in the classroom or studying from home. Some of this content is free. Some is available to our member schools, and some is available for a fee. Some programs come with kits that are delivered to teachers before the online programs occur. Teachers are so overwhelmed that they are appreciative of online content that they don't have to produce. Our students are just happy for the interesting change in their routines. So what about the future? Well, we recognize that running scientific experiments to provide accurate evidence-based data takes time and answers can't always keep up with the rapid pace of change in a pandemic. As new data becomes available from REALM, or from state and county government, or from our visitors, we try to be nimble and adapt quickly. There are lots of things in our society we just don't know yet. We are developing multiple scenarios for planning about when a vaccine may be found, about when more people will feel comfortable visiting and how our museum might look different after the pandemic and how we can better prepare for the next time around. Through it all, we try to stay focused on our mission of providing extraordinary family learning experiences in whatever form they take. >> Thank you so much, Chris. That was great. The pictures of your facility are amazing. We have been enjoying the dinosaur coming through the building and great you have been able to outfit them with masks to keep those guys safe. Thanks for sharing how your organization is approaching things and some of the policies and procedures you have been implementing for both your staff and the public. >> You're welcome. >> We've been collecting comments that came through and some questions. One of the biggest things I want to address before we dive in is there's a lot of questions about, what are your recommendations for? This is not something this project can provide. It is outside the scope because there are so many local factors that need to be considered that it is a decision that we encourage you to make locally, using the information, working with experts and support systems within your communities and within your states. To really form a policy and a procedure that works for your community. So I know that we would like to have that kind of an answer. It goes in our nature as information specialists, often, but we really encourage you to use the information that comes through REALM and through the CDC and other health agencies to help inform these discussions and decisions in your communities. So one of the things that came up was a quick question going back to some of the results I shared. Someone asked about what is LOQ. That is the level of quantitation. So when we are doing these tests that are being conducted by Battelle, they apply to a surface and use a process to determine how much virus remains, this is active virus capable of causing infection. From start to end that is what we are looking at, virus that is capable of KAUSZing infection. With the caveat of the known unknown of we don't know how much virus is needed. The scientists at Battelle need to use a microscope to see what is left. There are fewer than 26 cells behind when we start in the neighborhood of 100,000. When it is below the level of quantitation, it is below 26 and using a microscope to determine that number. Chrisone of the questions that came through for you is how you are checking daily on health to admission for staff and cleaning personnel. >> We have a separate entrance for staff and contractors that has been set up. Staff are required to register in advance for which days they are going to be in the building. That way if we ever have someone in the building who is infected we know who has been in contact with them. There is a separate entrance. Security mans that entrance. They check forehead temperatures and ask questions. We all in advance received those questions. So we know what symptoms we are being asked to report out. Whether or not we have had these symptoms and we sign in and sanitize our hands, sanitize our bags and go on to work. >> Great. Thank you. So I'll go back to a few questions about what we are looking at the difference between detectable virus and infection. That is a known unknown. We don't know how much virus is needed to cause infection. We don't know when handling materials how likely it is that virus could be transferred from an infected object. Let's say I sneeze on a book and put it in the book drop, we don't know how likely it is for that virus to be transferred off during handling. That is just one of the three things I highlighted in the beginning. We don't know how likely that is. The CDC has stated that while person-to-person contact, droplets is a much more likely form of transmission, infected objects have not been ruled out, but they are less likely at this point, based on the known information. So that is just a little bit about those. There are a couple of questions do we know of anyone becoming infected from museum materials and library materials. We haven't tracked that. It is difficult to track. Most of that is documented as people around an individual who was infected and coughing and sneezing. It is part of the reason we encourage you to look at the infection rate in your community when deciding what your local policy may be. If you have a really low infection rate, that may change your interest in quarantining, how long you choose to quarantine your items, if you do. There are a lot of variables there that could impact your local decision. So we have a question about how items were stacked during test 4 as opposed to open individually. So what we did in that test was stack like to like. A hard cover book, buckrum cloth was stacked against another one, right up against each oh, plastic protective cover against a plastic protective cover. And they -- that is how the virus was applied to the surface, a cover was applied and they would remove the cover to do the testing. Looking for a few more questions here . And Chris, can you share about how you calculated the maximum capacity for your museum? >> That was done, first of all, based on government guidelines for cultural institutions in our state. So we made sure we were under that capacity number and then we calculated square footage of circulation space. So we discounted anything that was already occupied by an object case or something like that and then calculated square footage for each experience and totalled that number. >> Great. Thank you. There is another question about a few of our tests, we have not gotten to what we would say is the level of detection, where we can't find any virus at all. You'll see that in the publication will say that the virus was still present at day six and day six was the last time point tested. And do we plan to go out further and look at additional time points? So at the beginning of each test, the scientific working group, operations working group, the project team including folks at Battelle, we look at types of materials we are testing and have to pick four time points. The materials are prepped and prepared and we test based on those time points. So we cannot justhood additional time points at the end because the materials were all prepared and made available. So there is a finite number. We can't automatically odd on extra days. The way the test process works, it is not compatible with that. So it is not something that we can do. In some cases we're certainly looking and using that information to inform the next set of tests. So we have a set of test results being released next week and those went out to day eight. So we are using it to inform and make decisions about how many days to go out, but unfortunately, it is not something we can change on the fly. There's a question about if heat is a killer of the virus and any chance that extreme cold does the trick? Coming from a sub arctic city. One of the things I wanted to know, we do have a literature review planning to be published next week. This is the second literature review being issued by this project. Some of the things the literature review is looking at include the impact of heat, temperature in general, what impact does colder temperatures have. The impact of ultraviolet light, the impact of humidity. So what the researchers at Battelle is to comb through research that has been published, since may of this year. We conducted a first phase of this project literature review that was covering through May. We did pretty much a gap analysis to look at what is happening in the last three or four months and pulled out data more relevant to our institutions, libraries, archives and museums. They synthesized that and made that part of the literature review. That will come out next week. Be sure to sign up to the project list if you want to get an update when that literature review is released. That is one place they are looking at cold. It does seem cold, which was in our literature review, extends the life of the virus and heat can help to accelerate the decay of the virus. I'm looking for a few more questions here. Chris, this is a good one. Are kids still having fun in your museum? >> Yeah, they are. It's really enjoyable to watch parents and grandparents with their kids experiencing some of their favorite things. As I said, expectations are important. Our marketing folks have done a good job of communicating to families in advance so that they know if they thing that they do every time they come to the museum has to be closed or altered, they are aware of it ahead of time and that really helps. But we've got half a million square feet indoor and 7 1/2 acres outdoors. The reality is few people can experience it all in one day anyway. So with a couple of things closed down, there's still really more than enough to enjoy. >> Mm-hmm. Have you heard from staff around concerns they have about cleaning the facilities and how they feel about the policies and procedures that are in place to help keep them safe? >> Sure. There's been a lot of internal training, discussion and listening, really good listening from our HR department. To staff and volunteers about their own personal concerns. The reality is, I think, people came back nervous and when they began implementing everything we've done, really feel like if you are going to be indoors, this is one of the safest places you can be. And so those, I think those fears have gone away. But managers and HR continue to do a good job listening and also listening to suggestions from floor staff for improvements that we can make. >> Great. Thank you. Let's see. A few more questions. We have just a few minutes left. So there are some questions around specific products to recommend. Just a reminder, Bexx mentioned the EPA list. Check those out for materials. A lot of the technology, for example, glass, plexiglas, these are hard surfaces which those EPA cleaning materials are more targeted towards because they are non-porous. Check out that list for things that might be appropriate, keeping in mind Bexx's suggestions about fragrances and the time it is required in order to work. That might help facilitating turnover between usages. And just seeing, there is a question about sanitizing bags. I'm not sure about the specifics on that one. You have new plastic bags that you send out. We are looking at maybe you are talking about canvas. Put some clarification there and see if we can't get that answer. For books, what is the best position to put them in quarantine? So what we found, I can't say it is the best, but what we found is there is an extension of time. If you stack materials. So check out the REALM results and you can get those details. And I just want to acknowledge now that we know how much uncertainty you all are dealing with and this is stressful and you are all trying to do the best by your organizations and by the staff and people who use your facilities. So keep asking questions, keep digging in. We are -- we want to answer as many questions as we can. There's a submission form on the REALM site where you can submit questions. Reach out and ask things locally. This is really important, I think, from a collaboration perspectiveperspective. Continue to read information that is out there and determine how best that information works in your community and put together the right plan for you. I want to thank you for your time. As you leave, you will have a quick survey you can complete. You can also reach out to me directly if you have any questions. And please be well and take care of yourself and thank you for being here and part of the day.